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January 05, 2010

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Tyler Hannan

I find the perspective given in the "real-time becomes normal" section exceptionally intriguing...

As an avid real-time communication user (and yes, that includes my mobile phone) the assumption of a real-time experience, akin to what I experience in my social endeavours, in my financial experience is a logical leap.

Given my experience with transaction processing and payments in general, I've come to "accept" (albeit grudgingly) the "why" behind the D+ and T+ discussions. But, as a typical consumer, (or even a technology savvy developer with little experience in transactional engagements) the expectation of real-time, put in the context given in this post, is understandable.

It is the process of putting ourselves into the mindset of others where we can gain additional clarity...

Thomas Barker

I doubt you see any move to clouds (in-house or public) for trade execution. I know people who work on low latency stuff - banks are starting to use specialised h/ware. Coding stuff into network cards, GPUs for realtime modelling, etc.

No one's going to save $5000 on h/ware for a $1m/sec system.

Mobile phone payments are going to take over from cards fast though... There's just so much more they can do over a card, and you don't need to mail one to each customer.

Alain Rogister

This raises two points:
1) No actual lessons have been drawn from the latest financial crisis. We are happily going towards a real-time cluster**** since no one can possibly predict with 100% accuracy the consequences of a fully (near-)real-time global financial system. Wishful thinking on real-time risk management cannot solve this.
2) Since light travels in optical fiber at 2/3 its speed in a vacuum, the lower bound on a 32000 km hop is 160 msec. Could you provide a reference to these wild claims of 1 msec ?

Chris Skinner

@Tyler

Thanks. Real-time as real-life is here!

@Thomas

I guess I see colo and prox hosting as moving towards private clouds for trade ex, but maybe that's just putting together 1+1?

@Alain

Agree on point (1).

On point (2), it does amaze me how low latency network providers are pushing the envelope here. THEY tell me that it is possible right now to do a global data hop in under 400 millisecs and, by end of this year, 1 millisec should be possible.

Go figure.

Alain Rogister

Chris,

Thanks for your answer. Ultra-low-latency requires proximity: 1 msec places a theoretical upper bound of 200km distance (i.e. tens of km in practice). Don't let vendor talk trick you into assuming that the law of physics are going to change :-)

Steve

I firmly believe that real-time payments and settlement processing, in today's global economy and financial markets, will eventually do away with banks having to settle their accounts at end-of-day with their respective central banks, thus allowing banks to process payments freely 24/7 around the globe. Trade transactions will continue to be settled by a certain date/time, but not a bank's entire central bank account. If this happens, the implications are huge, especially in the overnight funding markets. Also no more netting of positions at end-of-day; everything is real-time.

Chris Skinner

@Alain

I understand the proximity game and low latency challenges. The original 'limitation' I understood was 1 millisec for every 60 kilometres. I am now told this is being overcome through direct colo links between major centres.

Agree with you that there has to be some data drop even with such proximity hosting and colocation, but interesting to conjecture the possiblity that a real-time global loop could be feasible one day (and maybe one day soon).

@Steve

Wowser - when we get into real-time, a lot of interbank and intrabank processes become questionable or even redundant. Now that'll be the day.

Was fascinated for example by one payments head saying to me: "whatever our IT department say, it does not make sense to process a £50m for the same price as a £5, even thought it costs us no more in processing internally".

Hmmmmmm ...

Marcel den Hartog

As we have seen in recent publications, a large Korean credit card processor has moved its business critical applications from distributed platforms to a (new) Mainframe (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/05/ibm_bc_card_mainframe/). Back to the future? Many large companies are slowly starting to realise that the current infrastructure of distributed systems is expensive, inflexible, not secure and not very green ( http://www.ca.com/Files/SupportingPieces/ca_mainframe_survey_report_208226.pdf) Administration and Management costs are skyrocketing and do not scale against the actual workload of these systems. Many large banks who already own an IBM zSeries Mainframe have already changed the status of their Mainframe from “Obsolete, let’s get rid of it” to, “Strategic, cost efficient, it’s a major part of our future IT Strategy” (http://www.ca.com/Files/SupportingPieces/vertical_findings_executive_summary_215877.pdf) . The reasons are obvious, a Cloud running on multiple virtual zLinux machines that closely connect to > 60% of the corporate data and are fully under control and very secure is not only very attractive, but the costs associated with it will be substantially lower than building an internal Cloud infrastructure. And now we are seeing that companies are even buying new mainframes. With the current state of the art technology and attractive pricing from IBM and ISV’s, more will follow…

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